Curse

JDRyder · Aug 31, 2008, 12:11 AM // 00:11

cuz thats what you seem to apply.

upier · Aug 31, 2008, 06:49 AM // 06:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by JDRyder

cuz thats what you seem to apply.

No, you seem just unable to understand the basic English language:

Quote:

Originally Posted by upier

You stated that "everything" in GW can be done in more then two ways.
And that is true for most part.
I am able to do a lot of things with a very varied combination of classes and a varied combination of skills.
In a game with 10 classes and only 8 slots - that's pretty much a must.

I mean how hard can it be?

What you are doing is applying the rule "since a lot of things have multiple ways (more then two) of doing it, then EVERYTHING has multiple ways of doing it" despite failing to produce a real game example when asked to do so.

Like I said - certain end-game areas aren't open to guilds only because these guilds would represent a gathering of higher skilled players - they are open to guilds only because only they can put together the needed cookie.
And that's it's bad.

JDRyder · Aug 31, 2008, 10:08 AM // 10:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by upier

Like I said - certain end-game areas aren't open to guilds only because these guilds would represent a gathering of higher skilled players - they are open to guilds only because only they can put together the needed cookie.
And that's it's bad.

umm no?

People run cookies cuz they dont know what they are doing and think if its not in the wiki build then it bad. TAM does BYOB HM UW and duns all the time and still do it just as fast as a set team build

upier · Aug 31, 2008, 11:00 AM // 11:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by JDRyder

umm no?

People run cookies cuz they dont know what they are doing and think if its not in the wiki build then it bad. TAM does BYOB HM UW and duns all the time and still do it just as fast as a set team build

I didn't know DoA could be spelled as "UW" also.

Please, run your BYOB vs Mallyx.

Faure · Aug 31, 2008, 11:25 AM // 11:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkSpirit

This is sad, especially since both my guilds are deserted now.

I dont care if Ursan is bad or not, I just want the game to be playable, but I guess that is too much to ask from ANet. If they want to nerf Ursan, fine by me, provided the game is still as playable as before.

The after effect of the nerf is just horrible. DoA is a ghost town.

Seems like your both guilds are crap if they don't wanna play without ursan imo.

Spiritz · Aug 31, 2008, 11:35 AM // 11:35

Why are ppl still saying doa is dead as well as other elite areas ?
Ursan nerf hasnt stopped those ursan users who are comitted as ive still seen ursan groups after consets and theres still some ursan builds being made - Just coz you dont see the mass ursan lfg messages that much in toa now doesnt mean it gone.
And theres still plenty of doa farmers on the go.

We have to remember gw has ppl from entire world and we may use 1 or 2 language districts so we cant compare euro english to asian.
I could sit in Chantry of secrets in euro eng 1 and see maybe a handfull of ppl - would that mean uw is dead ..... ? but if i went to Toa id see loads of people.

I may have said in earlier post - join a pug and even if the party sucks keep trying as you`ll all learn/improve together.Ask guild members if anyone fancies trying it and go from there.If we all sat on our backsides and didnt try then we`d all be guild sitting and nothing will be done.

End of the Day - Only you can change things by trying and you never know it may pay off

high priestess anya · Sep 22, 2008, 03:30 PM // 15:30

anyone who says ursan was only used by idiots is quite simply a moron. ursan was a means to an end and a very fast end also, it was the shortcut to grinds which we ere all sick off anyway, about leet areas...my friends tell me that pugs are doing cryway and succesfully, ok maybe not to the extent of ursan but hey..leyts be brutally honest, where is the skill in spamming 8 skills (compared to ursans 5)
i hope gw2 has a lot more versatility because i got very bored of wasting 3 hours of my life getting half way accross a map for nothing more than a mere mission or sidequest
you got peeps crying that ursan needed to be nerfed and you got peeps crying that its been nerfed...its just a game for godsake, whats with all the politics? ok ursan abused the game but its solved now so go run cryway and forget about ursan or your "leet as hec" scythe wars when, lets face it, dervish are better with scythes than lumpy old men...sorry i mean warriors

oh btw, some of the leetest players in the game where running ursan quite simply for the riches.
so watch where you swing your "i declare you an idiot/noob" stick

Tyla · Sep 22, 2008, 03:54 PM // 15:54

Ursan allowed you to get away with spamming your skills aimlessly, and Cry of Pain requires you not to be an idiot and CoP on a target without a Mesmer hex. That, and and elite mission is supposed to take alot of time anyway.

glacialphoenix · Sep 22, 2008, 03:58 PM // 15:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by high priestess anya

anyone who says ursan was only used by idiots is quite simply a moron

I don't think it was so much as 'ursan=idiot' as 'idiot=ursan'. You had good players who ran ursan, sure. But you also had a lot - and probably a good deal more people who ran ursan because they weren't good at running anything else.

DarkSpirit · Sep 22, 2008, 04:09 PM // 16:09

I think people forget that the ultimate goal of a game is to have FUN. If most people cant have fun in this game, then this game becomes a failure period.

On one side, you have some people pushing that elite content should be exclusive and be so hard that the place should be almost deserted except for the players belonging to the most active guilds. On the other side, you have the rest of the player base that want access.

If you dont belong to an active guild, doesn't necessarily mean you suck. If you belong to one, doesn't necessarily mean you are good either. At one time or another, most people in GW belonged to an active guild anyway.

If ANet wants to make elite content so difficult that PUGs are almost non-existant in those areas then fine. But in return, I wish every area in guild wars would be possible with heroes. I have always supported the idea of a full party hero or enabling the PvE skills for heroes.

Tyla · Sep 22, 2008, 04:15 PM // 16:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkSpirit

On one side, you have some people pushing that elite content should be exclusive and be so hard that the place should be as almost deserted except for the players belonging to the most active guilds. On the other side, you have the rest of the player base that want access.

Yes, make it easier just because people can't do it. Get rid of the essence of challenge that is supposed to reside in that area.

Elite areas are supposed to be challenging and long, they're not supposed to easy and quick. It's not "exclusive" either. Anyone can access any stage of the game as long as they unlock it.

I've said this before, and I'll say it again:

Quote:

Without EM (Easy Mode), people can't be bothered and put it aside out of laziness.

DarkSpirit · Sep 22, 2008, 11:08 PM // 23:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyla

Yes, make it easier just because people can't do it. Get rid of the essence of challenge that is supposed to reside in that area.

What is the essence of challenge? The challenge of bringing a max of 3 overpowered PvE skills in a H/H team or the challenge of bringing a max of 24 PvE skills in human guild team?

In general, it is more difficult to have to H/H everything or work with 6 heroes because you can't find another human to help you out.

If you have 7 other experienced guild members to help you out to complete elite missions, it just means you took the easier path that's all. And the game is skewed, on purpose, to grant advantages to human teams than H/H teams in terms of PvE skills and consummables.

In my opinion, those who completed the same elite mission with just 6 heroes demonstrated more skill than those who go with a well prepared full guild team. Sitting on the coat tails of others.

Tyla · Sep 22, 2008, 11:12 PM // 23:12

That's merely taking advantage of what exists in that scenario. Either way, my point still stands. Who cares how challenging it was when the point is that people won't bother to get off their arses and make an effort instead of sitting there and saying "screw it."?

By the way, why wouldn't you be well prepared for something...?

Conclusion here: People don't want to do it because they're either lazy or they find the area doesn't offer enough incentive.

DarkSpirit · Sep 22, 2008, 11:23 PM // 23:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyla

By the way, why wouldn't you be well prepared for something...?

Well prepared as in having guild members who have done it before telling you where to stand in foundry, or what build to bring etc. Compare that advantage to someone who is on his/her own, in an empty guild and has to rely on heroes and henchies to carry them through.

The latter case requires more skills, from the player, than the former. Not to mention consummables+more overpowered PvE skills, etc.

Quote:

Conclusion here: People don't want to do it because they're either lazy or they find the area doesn't offer enough incentive.

There is also the fact that DoA is not that easy to complete with just 6 heroes, so trying to "solo" it with just 6 heroes maybe too hard.

And of course, someone who in an active guild can just say, it was EASY, my guildies helped me out, you guys are just lazy!

Tyla · Sep 22, 2008, 11:29 PM // 23:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkSpirit

Well prepared as in having guild members who have done it before telling you where to stand in foundry, or what build to bring etc. Compare that advantage to someone who is on his/her own, in an empty guild and has to rely on heroes and henchies to carry them through.

The latter case requires more skills, from the player, than the former.

Everyone has a starting point in something sometimes. Information is and has been passed on throughout all of time, and this is no different. Search around and find information if you really need to know.

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There is also the fact that DoA is not that easy to complete with just 6 heroes, so trying to "solo" it with just 6 heroes maybe too hard.

And why are there mostly heroways for DoA in your example?

Oh wait, it's on the tip of my tongue... oh yeah, because of the reasons already listed

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And of course, someone who in an active guild can just say, it was EASY, my guildies helped me out, you guys are just lazy!

A heavily set up build with an Earth Shaker who isn't terribad and other melee that know how to position themselves in such a way they can protect the backline via bodyblocking, also helping the Earth Shaker should suffice.

A fairly decent Earth Shaker can easily make groups clear easily, especially those Stygians. Divert Hexes can clear Gloom unless you make a terrible mistake. The rest is quite straight-forward. An Imbagon helps too.

Make some friends, get some people you know on GWG to come, make connections.

DarkSpirit · Sep 22, 2008, 11:35 PM // 23:35

What I am saying is, if they dont make DoA easier then fine but at least make it easier for the solo players who can't find alot of people to party with. Allow heroes to use PvE skills and allow a full party of heroes.

Humans are not always available to party you and having such a big difference in advantage between 3 max PvE skills/team against 24 max PvE skills/team is too unfair to H/H people.

There still a big difference in difficulty between 1guy+6heroes and 8 guys in a well prepared cryway team.

Cathode_Reborn · Sep 23, 2008, 01:35 AM // 01:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyla

Make some friends, get some people you know on GWG to come, make connections.

This is one of the big things.

I've been guildless for over a week and I do DoA almost daily. This is coming from someone that avoids joining "elite" guilds, or ones with too many members. All it takes is 2 people to get a full run done. If you use a Celerity it becomes alot easier.

There's tons of people that wanna get DoA done. If you really absolutely don't know anyone that wants team up for it, use Guru's pug section. Or you can try finding a pug ingame - even if you know it's guaranteed to be a failure, join anyways......It's not uncommon to find a least one or two people in the group that knows what they're doing.

DarkSpirit · Sep 23, 2008, 06:47 AM // 06:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cathode_Reborn

This is one of the big things.

I've been guildless for over a week and I do DoA almost daily. This is coming from someone that avoids joining "elite" guilds, or ones with too many members. All it takes is 2 people to get a full run done. If you use a Celerity it becomes alot easier.

There's tons of people that wanna get DoA done. If you really absolutely don't know anyone that wants team up for it, use Guru's pug section. Or you can try finding a pug ingame - even if you know it's guaranteed to be a failure, join anyways......It's not uncommon to find a least one or two people in the group that knows what they're doing.

Unfortunately, most single persons that I team up with, that bring their heroes, tend to fail at foundry room 3. And I am not going to use a consummable.

Tyla · Sep 23, 2008, 03:54 PM // 15:54

Well, you're the one gimping yourself in that situation with the consumables.

You can't expect to complete an area built to be hard with incredible ease and no player skill investment. Connections with other players is an incredible thing to take advantage of, as are PvE skills, consumables and all of that crap we have today.

Unreal Havoc · Sep 23, 2008, 04:15 PM // 16:15

The really simple point here is if you're not taking full advantage of everything the game and various other facilites have to offer, to get the job done, then you have no grounds for complaint.

As for the original post most players will just go to the farms that make them the most money the fastest/easiest way without having to resort to waiting on guilds or alliances to form teams. Most of these fast farming areas have set team builds for said farms that are already set in stone, successful, and don't take over two hours for the average PuG (UW, Thommis's dungeon, Cathedral of Flames) to finish.